Trunks Or No Trunks? THAT Is The Question......

Which way do you go?

I posted this in a thread in another topic, but I think it belongs here:

You know, there really IS an easy explanation for the trunks. I was planning on keeping this little idea to myself, but in the long-run it won't really matter. Here goes:

Clark Kent is raised in Smallville, KS. Mid-West America. What is INSANELY popular in the Mid-West? No, not talking about NASCAR. I'm talking about professional wrestling.

Colorful, costumed characters fighting "evil" in tights? Nah, I don't see how THAT could possibly influence a young Mid-Western farm boy named Clark Kent. Now, I'm not saying make it a HUGE part of his childhood, but show him watching it as a kid, and have his favorite wrestler wearing trunks over his tights. When he and Martha begin to come up with the costume, have it be something that pops in his head to "inspire" him to copy the look.

Superman was "modeled" after circus strongmen back in the day. Since those days are ancient history now, look to the current crop of performing "strongmen" for inspiration. It makes sense, and would probably draw-in fans of professional wrestling in the process.

And all of this coming from someone who stopped watching wrestling when he was 13 years old....

I'd have thought it goes without saying... but just in case, my tendency is to err in staying as true to the comics as possible. The trunks STAY. Singer tried to "innovate" with his little BJ Routh pleather bikini and look how THAT turned out.

As ever, go classic or get out.

I say keep it. No reason not to do them.

hate, hate, hate the trunks. It's a very dated look. I recall Batman fans were up in arms about the possibility of the traditional costume being changed...once everyone saw how nicely the new look was...all was well. I know there are traditionalists that can't fathom the idea but really, it's 2011... time for Superman to grow up!

Disagree but welcome aboard Alonzo.

I said this before at a different board if and that is a big if trunks where notused. I wouldn't be against if they went with maybe some red pattern design in waist area to break up the blue. But trunks would be more perfered option.

alonzo wrote:hate, hate, hate the trunks. It's a very dated look. I recall Batman fans were up in arms about the possibility of the traditional costume being changed...once everyone saw how nicely the new look was...all was well. I know there are traditionalists that can't fathom the idea but really, it's 2011... time for Superman to grow up!

Sorry, but there comes a point where something goes BEYOND the point of being considered "dated", and Superman's costume has reached that point.

Batman's costume has always been about "pieces". The cowl. The pointy ears. The utility belt. The symbol. The cape. That's it. Take a look at this picture:

Can you tell who it is? I bet you can. Even though you don't see ANYTHING but a shadow, you know it's Batman. Why? Because of the things mentioned above, sans the belt.

Now take Superman. Look at this picture, and see how it is illustrated:

Batman in the shadows, only thing showing is the pointy ears, cowl, and cape. Superman? The symbol. THE TRUNKS. The cape. The boots. Why? Because they ALL make-up what makes Superman SUPERMAN.

The trunks stay ad infinitum.

I have nothing aganist Supes with his red trunks outside his suit but lets face it having it display on film around the current times will just lead to some encouragement for criticism! Which is why the best way to go is to make a red color scheme below the waist so that it may look like red underwear but it's actually just a red scheme design thats is part of the suit. As Webhead2006 stated best... Just put in some red pattern design in waist area to break up the blue!

Comicbookfan-V2 wrote:I have nothing aganist Supes with his red trunks outside his suit but lets face it having it display on film around the current times will just lead to some encouragement for criticism! Which is why the best way to go is to make a red color scheme below the waist so that it may look like red underwear but it's actually just a red scheme design thats is part of the suit. As Webhead2006 stated best... Just put in some red pattern design in waist area to break up the blue!

Disagree. With a character like Batman, a lot of his outfit must serve a functional purpose in addition to an aesthetic purpose. There's more leeway there.

As far as Superman goes though, his outfit is primarily a symbol, strictly aesthetic. I would therefore argue you don't have the same room to manipulate Superman's appearance that you would with Batman.

In addition... I've only rarely heard Superman be ridiculed for the trunks. The majority of the ones who did primarily had no use for superheroes whatsoever so that's a segment of the market that's likely unreachable irrespective of how the character looks.

Lastly, the design of The Suit has endured for decades. Decades. If Superman had only come out in the comics 5 or 10 years ago, you could argue it'd be okay to alter The Suit. But after damn near 75 years of comics, tons of cartoons, tone of TV shows, several movies, etc, there's simply no merit to the argument that The Suit needs alteration. It's been what it is longer than any of us have been alive.

Keep the trunks.

Comicbookfan-V2 wrote:I have nothing aganist Supes with his red trunks outside his suit but lets face it having it display on film around the current times will just lead to some encouragement for criticism! Which is why the best way to go is to make a red color scheme below the waist so that it may look like red underwear but it's actually just a red scheme design thats is part of the suit. As Webhead2006 stated best... Just put in some red pattern design in waist area to break up the blue!

Can you point to ONE example of people "criticizing" the trunks after 'All-Star Superman' came out on DVD? There were tons of reviews and reaction to the most recent animated DVD. Surely if THIS were the case, you should be able to find ample examples.

Do it, and come back with some "ammo".

Apologist Puncher wrote:Can you point to ONE example of people "criticizing" the trunks after 'All-Star Superman' came out on DVD? There were tons of reviews and reaction to the most recent animated DVD. Surely if THIS were the case, you should be able to find ample examples.

Do it, and come back with some "ammo".

Alrighty then, I like a challenge! But I also want to acknowledge that Supes has also starred in the first two live action films that were actually successful, so much to the point that there wasen't even a hint of criticism involving him wearing red trunks but only because that was about three decades back and the only reason why no one in the current times has complained about it because it actually works in animation awhole lot more than live action which is awhole different story.

Here's a links to a page from Comicbookmovie.com that kind of prove my point...

http://comicbookmovie.com/fansites/captainsaveashow/news/?a=16822

That is your answer?? Some jackoff from comicbookmovie.com expressing an opinion as though it's fact? "It just doesn't work in live action apart from four movies, three TV shows and two serials!"

Yeah, real persuasive argument, that one.

Comicbookfan-V2 wrote:Alrighty then, I like a challenge! But I also want to acknowledge that Supes has also starred in the first two live action films that were actually successful, so much to the point that there wasen't even a hint of criticism involving him wearing red trunks but only because that was about three decades back and the only reason why no one in the current times has complained about it because it actually works in animation awhole lot more than live action which is awhole different story.

Here's a links to a page from Comicbookmovie.com that kind of prove my point...

http://comicbookmovie.com/fansites/captainsaveashow/news/?a=16822

Did you read my post earlier, where I provided pictorial EVIDENCE to support my assessment? Not just a link to a hack site where a FEW morons think only THEIR opinions matter?

Yeah, this is for you:

Apologist Puncher wrote:Did you read my post earlier, where I provided pictorial EVIDENCE to support my assessment? Not just a link to a hack site where a FEW morons think only THEIR opinions matter?

Not much to add here. But...

That caption really says it all. How the hell do you manage that? Oh well, it was probably an Apologist behind the wheel.

thecolorsblend wrote:That caption really says it all. How the hell do you manage that? Oh well, it was probably an Apologist behind the wheel.

Yep. You can just imagine them saying "oooo, wuz dat bj ruth dere at da buss stopd? mibe i culd get da auto*CRASH*".

Apologist Puncher wrote:Did you read my post earlier, where I provided pictorial EVIDENCE to support my assessment? Not just a link to a hack site where a FEW morons think only THEIR opinions matter?

Ugh!!! Look, all I said was in my first post is that I never had a problem with Supe's in red trunks and I also pacificly said in my second post is that it only looks better in animation than in live action aleast in the current times anyways thats if of course if you have read those posts? That link to that page from Comicbookmovie.com was just to show how much people are alittle deadset on seeing Supes in red trunks in a modern film.

So by all means, don't take my word for it!

Comicbookfan-V2 wrote:Ugh!!! Look, all I said was in my first post is that I never had a problem with Supe's in red trunks

Actually, you said THIS:

Comicbookfan-V2 wrote:I have nothing aganist Supes with his red trunks outside his suit but lets face it having it display on film around the current times will just lead to some encouragement for criticism!

Criticism? Riiight....

You also said this:

Which is why the best way to go is to make a red color scheme below the waist so that it may look like red underwear

ANYONE who calls the trunks "underwear" is NOT respecting the character or his history.

Comicbookfan-V2 wrote:and I also pacificly said in my second post is that it only looks better in animation than in live action aleast in the current times anyways thats if of course if you have read those posts?

An opinion based on NOTHING.

That link to that page from Comicbookmovie.com was just to show how much people are alittle deadset on seeing Supes in red trunks in a modern film.

I agree. You finally got something right!

So by all means, don't take my word for it!

Since you don't respect Superman, and are trying to claim that people WANT to change his costume when this is faaaar from the truth, I won't.

Apologist Puncher wrote:Since you don't respect Superman, and are trying to claim that people WANT to change his costume when this is faaaar from the truth, I won't.

More likely Alteration or Modernize maybe the best terms than Change aleast thats what we modern folks perfer since this is, well you know... The modern times and we're basicly keeping up with it while some people just have learn to stop living in the past and just get with the program at hand!

Need I remind you what they did with "Superman Returns" and the results that came with it?

Comicbookfan-V2 wrote:More likely Alteration or Modernize maybe the best terms than Change aleast thats what we modern folks perfer since this is, well you know... The modern times

YOU are "modern"? Are you effin' serious?

alteration: n. an adjustment, change, or modification

change: v. To give a completely different form or appearance to; transform

Guess which one YOU are advocating, genius?

and we're basicly keeping up with it while some people just have learn to stop living in the past and just get with the program at hand!

What the fuck are YOU doing specifically, dingleberry? Besides posting badly spelled and nonsensical posts on internet message boards?

I hope, hope, HOPE you are expecting the trunks to be gone in the new film. Your ass is going to be in for one hell of a disappointment.

Need I remind you what they did with "Superman Returns" and the results that came with it?

You mean ALTERING the trunks to look like a shitty speedo? Yeah, see what happens when you screw around with a classic?

Use your brain kid.

Apologist Puncher wrote:ANYONE who calls the trunks "underwear" is NOT respecting the character or his history.

There's even a bit of superiority (or insecurity... or SOMEthing) in calling them "briefs" but even that's better and more respectful than "underwear".

thecolorsblend wrote:There's even a bit of superiority (or insecurity... or SOMEthing) in calling them "briefs" but even that's better and more respectful than "underwear".

When you go swimming, do you wear "underwear", or "swimming trunks"? Do professional wrestlers wear "underwear" or "wrestling trunks"? Did circus strongmen wear "underwear" over their tights, or "trunks"?

It's a term that less-than-intelligent individuals use to "mock" the character, because deep-down they do NOT like Superman, and never have. If it wasn't Superman, they would be bitching about Batman, or Spider-Man, or Captain America, etc.

They have issues, and whether Superman wears trunks or not is the least of them.

I think it was the Daredevil DVD extras but there's an interview floating around out there with Frank Miller where he basically says that comic book fans have a really bizarre self-esteem issue when it comes to their preferred medium. I think that basic insecurity lies at the root of a lot peoples wishes to "modernize" and "make realistic" a lot of superhero material. You can even get by with that when it comes to certain characters... but there's no "updating" certain things.

For example, the only way to do a Legion of Super-Heroes movie would be to completely embrace the concept. All of it. The powers, the futuristic setting, the characters' names, the group's origin, the whole thing. You can't mitigate the science-fantasy elements in hopes that wide audiences won't think you're "one of the nerds". If you don't believe in the material, audiences won't either.

Of all characters, I'd argue that this is most true of Superman. Forcing him into a realistic setting, "updating" (ie, intentionally fucking up) The Suit, all that shit undermines the character and ultimately makes him more irrelevant than simply adapting him as he is from the comics.

We've already had an "updated" version of The Suit with the Singerman bikini... and time has told on that one. It was a shit concept. It was shit in execution. And years later... it's still shit.

Go classic or get out.

Ugh!!! For the last fucking time I don't AND I REPEAT I don't have a problem OR have anything against Superman wearing red trunks outside his suit I'm only pointing out that other people may have a problem with it maybe not hardcore fans but other kinds of fans... And no not the type of fans you maybe thinking about! I for one don't give a damn if he does wears trunks or not!

I'm also saying that the idea for a red design scheme below the belt may avoid some backlash that may follow! Plus he'll just look weird without any red underneath the waist!

And another thing... Your saying that I don't respect Superman? I wouldn't be making suggestions on how he should be portrayed nor be a member of this site if I didn't! Hell, I wouldn't be a former member of Savesuperman.com or sign a petition for a new Superman reboot film to be green lighted if what you say about me is true! Haven't you heard the stuff that people are saying about Superman lately? Cause I certainly have but I also never agree with them!!!

Now tell me again that I don't respect Superman? Aleast I'm trying to avoid seeing another Superman film being Singered if you get my drift!

P.S. For christ sake, are we done with the nitpicking for today??!