Re: DCnU Superman Thread (re: Action Comics and Superman)

[thecolorsblend]

Ah ok thanks colors, sounds nice. Glad to see they have moved again away from ice world/donner look.

Eye of the beholder, perhaps. There were a few columns in that apartment or ballroom or whatever that Lara was hanging out in that looked like they could've been Donner-inspired. But maybe not.

[webhead2006]

Ya i guess it will have to be a wait and see if they show any more of krypton in a later issue then right. But even if there was just a few design flairs of crystal colums or what not i dont see that as all bad deal. From what you said other wise there is some good differences this krypton compared to the donner one.

[Apologist Puncher]

http://dcu.blog.dccomics.com/2011/11/08/three-things-you-need-to-know-about-%E2%80%A6-action-comics/

THREE THINGS YOU NEED TO KNOW ABOUT … ACTION COMICS
Tuesday, November 8th, 2011

By Wil Moss


Some have said that three is the magic number. If that’s the case, November should be a fascinating month. Here at THE SOURCE, we’ll spotlighting key third issues from DC COMICS-THE NEW 52 with an ongoing series of posts titled “3 Things You Didn’t Know About DC COMICS-THE NEW 52.” Expect the unexpected–in threes.

1) BACKUPS ARE COMING

Starting with #4 (on sale 12/7), ACTION COMICS will now include eight-page backups written by Grant Morrison’s hand-picked choice, Sholly Fisch (writer of THE ALL NEW BATMAN THE BRAVE & THE BOLD). Each one will tie in directly with the 20-page lead story. What’s the backup of #4 about? Well, that brings us to our next “thing you need to know”…

2) STEEL IS MAKING HIS “NEW 52” DEBUT

The lead story in ACTION #4 by Grant Morrison and Rags Morales features the debut of the “New 52” Steel! Last we saw of John Henry Irons, in ACTION #2, he had quit his military job in protest over Lex Luthor torturing Superman under General Lane’s command. Now, as the Terminauts lay siege to Metropolis, it’s time for John Henry to put his money where his mouth is and go help Superman defend the city. The backup in #4 ties into the main story by depicting a critical fight between Steel and the brand new Metall-0!

3) BRAD WALKER AND CHRISCROSS TO DRAW BACKUPS

Brad Walker (HEROES FOR HIRE) is drawing the backup in #4. The backups of #5 — spotlighting Ma & Pa Kent — and #6 will be drawn by ChrisCross (SUPERMAN/BATMAN). The backup of #7 sees Brad Walker return to the art, and then #8 — the conclusion of the first storyarc — is one big issue-long epic by Grant Morrison and Rags Morales!

As a bonus, check out this first look at Steel’s armor by Brad Walker (based off a design by Rags Morales)! Much in the same way that Superman is wearing jeans and a T-shirt in this current arc, at this point Steel’s armor is in its “prototype” phase. Look for the final design somewhere down the line, but in the meantime, get ready for one heck of a throwdown!

- Wil Moss, Associate Editor, ACTION COMICS

[webhead2006]

Boy he has a strange prototype look there.

[thecolorsblend]

1) BACKUPS ARE COMING

Fuck's sake...

Okay, (A) at least 9 out of 10 backups completely suck. It's as simple as that. But (B) most comic stories go 22 pages. Not 21. Not 23. 22. That's the basic industry standard right there. So what? Big hairy deal, right? Well, rumors with teeth have said the New 52 creative teams didn't have as much lead time on this sucker as you'd normally want to give. And hey, what a co-inky-dink, right around the time the deadline crunches REALLY would've been affecting them, here come the backups.

Each one will tie in directly with the 20-page lead story.

See above.

2) STEEL IS MAKING HIS “NEW 52” DEBUT

Hm. This is a pretty major sea change. Superboy's origin seems to have been satisfactorily removed from the Doomsday storyline. Which I don't have an opinion about one way or the other. But Steel really sets it all in stone. I guess Doomsday (the story) is out of continuity now.

That kinda makes me wonder how Kyle Rayner ever became a Green Lantern but hey...

[Apologist Puncher]

That kinda makes me wonder how Kyle Rayner ever became a Green Lantern but hey...

[thecolorsblend]

Well, it kind of pisses me off, you know? Overall, I think The New 52 has had some really cool concepts and ideas going. But, apart from needlessly ditching The Suit, the main black mark is the lack of a total reboot. On the one hand, I can understand DC wanting to keep the Batman and GL stuff in continuity since that stuff has been working for them. But the problem with warm reboots/partial reboots/giant fucking retcons is that anything less than a hard reboot has a demonstrable track record of confusion.

On top of all that, you could quite easily argue that Batman has never truly been rebooted. Year One was published but that was a retconned origin. When that storyline wrapped up, DC more or less picked up where they'd left off, with Jason as Robin and so forth. The stories published in the 70's and early/mid 80's were still in continuity or at least hadn't been explicitly ruled out. And that rickety house of cards is where Batman's continuity stands to this very day, only now it's even worse.

Makes sense that DC doesn't want to throw the baby out with the bathwater, I get that, but either shit or get off the pot.

Apart from that stuff, I'm digging this new direction.

[Apologist Puncher]

Keep in mind something: These changes weren't done for the longtime-fans.

So they are going to do whatever they like until it fails.

[thecolorsblend]

Keep in mind something: These changes weren't done for the longtime-fans.

So they are going to do whatever they like until it fails.

Hey, preaching to the choir. I've seen a lot of longtimers go into absolute meltdown over some of this stuff. You surfed a Teen Titans forum lately? "Acid bath" doesn't even cover it.

Here's the thing though. With exceptions (Batman, GL, Legion of Super-Heroes and maybe a couple of others), the continuity in many cases is being restarted. And even where it isn't, I've seen that the stories are being written intentionally as a entry points for new readers. Both of the big publishers make noises about "finding new fans" but so often their actions defy their words. But in the case the New 52, the majority of books seem to be geared toward either a reboot or else an easy jump-on point.

Beyond that, DC has entered the digital distribution market. They've done so about as carefully as they can without risking the existence of retailers or their relationship with Diamond, both of which form the foundation of their day-to-day operations. They're looking to reach the tech market, the folks with iPads.

I guess my point is that I don't begrudge DC doing this... IF it's successful. And obviously it's too soon to say. But so far, they're making a good faith effort to expand their market. If they can pull this off and put more comics in the hands of more readers... hey, I'll be prepared to call this thing a fairly qualified success.

[webhead2006]

That is how i feel about it too colors, i may not read alot of dc stuff but even from what little i know about the now former continuity stuff. It is just a mess to say this happened to this character but all this stuff in other characters is different. So as much as i hate reboots myself at times. it would have been alot better to clean house and start anew for the whole company.

[thecolorsblend]

http://www.popmatters.com/pm/feature/151387-missing-persons-a-second-chance-at-superman

[quote=Pop Matters]Even if these stories have inspired Lois Lane and his other coworkers, the Clark Kent of Superman is still very much an outsider. With his super-hearing, Clark eavesdrops on Lois saying, he’s such a “loner” and that he “never really lets anyone get close to him.” It seems Superman’s hero identity has hindered not only his capacity to serve the common man, but also his life as Clark Kent.

In Action Comics, Clark intentionally makes himself the outsider. He wears oversized clothes to make himself look smaller, Converses, and Coke bottle glasses that make his eyes look bigger. He musses up his hair and stoops his shoulders. And when speaking to Inspector Blake, he is self-righteous like his alter ego, and says, “You need to be the cop you wanted to be when you were a kid.” His measures may seem extreme, but he still has a friend with shared beliefs.[/quote]
I would say she offers a pretty accurate distillation of what Perez and Morrison have been up to. The whole thing is worth reading, for summary purposes if nothing else.

[thecolorsblend]

Also, some preview images from Superman #3.



More can be found at http://www.worldofsuperheroes.com/comics/new-52-superman-issue-3-preview-some-good-comic-art-of-kal-el-flying

[Apologist Puncher]

I just love that the combination of "Superman + SHITTY ART" continues.....

[thecolorsblend]

I'm not crazy about the philosophy behind the Rags Morales Superman but I've got no real beef with the final product. True, the guy's no Phil Jimenez or Frances Manapul but he gets the job done rather nicely.

Besides that, Dan Jurgens is going to be replacing Angel Merino on Superman pretty soon and, of all people, Jurgens has got nothing to prove to anybody when it comes to badass Superman comics, as far as I'm concerned. I haven't heard (but seriously doubt) that Brett Breeding will be coming back so there's some concern about the inker but (A) Jurgens' talent has a funny of way of shining through anyway and (B) as much as I otherwise respect the guy, it's not like it'll be any worse than the inking Art Thibert used to do on Jurgens' stuff waaay back in the early 90's (for those who remember those Adventures of Superman issues).

[Apologist Puncher]

I'm not crazy about the philosophy behind the Rags Morales Superman but I've got no real beef with the final product. True, the guy's no Phil Jimenez or Frances Manapul but he gets the job done rather nicely.

I disagree. The art has no "pop" to it, and would do a piss-poor job of attracting someone's eye.

Especially if they were new to comics.

Besides that, Dan Jurgens is going to be replacing Angel Merino on Superman pretty soon and, of all people, Jurgens has got nothing to prove to anybody when it comes to badass Superman comics, as far as I'm concerned. I haven't heard (but seriously doubt) that Brett Breeding will be coming back so there's some concern about the inker but (A) Jurgens' talent has a funny of way of shining through anyway and (B) as much as I otherwise respect the guy, it's not like it'll be any worse than the inking Art Thibert used to do on Jurgens' stuff waaay back in the early 90's (for those who remember those Adventures of Superman issues).

I'd be curious to see what Jurgens could bring to the table. But they can bring Bogdanove back, who I love, and even HE couldn't make me like that stupid "costume".

Either of them.

[Apologist Puncher]

Check this guy's art out:

http://spoonr.tumblr.com/post/1175970518/matthew-humphreys-superman-sketches



I think a style like this is PERFECT for Superman. If I saw a cover with a style like that, clean AND detailed, I would definitely think twice about purchasing it.

DC seriously needs to think about trying to find the right artist to fit the character, instead of trying to find the right NAME.

[webhead2006]

That is some nice artwork there and i agree with your statement man. Its like for me with spider-man i have seem some great artists on spidey like the romitas, bagley and others, and then i have seen some bad ones(cant recall names off hand of bad ones). But its nice when they do stick with good artist on what ever book i am reading.

[Apologist Puncher]

Apparently THIS "Superman" kills?



Does this not concern anyone else but me?

[thecolorsblend]

I was under the impression that parademons (or the new school versions anyway) are cyborgs or robots or whatever. Destroying them isn't really taking a life, in other words.

Even so, I could excuse that given the popcorny "turn your brain off at the door" vibe of the new JL book. But Superman threatening Lex's life in Action #2 is a bigger deal, in my opinion, given the clear black & white/life vs. murder implication going on there.

[Apologist Puncher]

I was under the impression that parademons (or the new school versions anyway) are cyborgs or robots or whatever. Destroying them isn't really taking a life, in other words.

Ah, so then we should expect to see this "Superman" kill the following:

Metallo


Brainiac


Amazo


And others? Seeing as how they are either cyborgs or robots?

Do you really not see the problem with what that panel represents, colors?

Even so, I could excuse that given the popcorny "turn your brain off at the door" vibe of the new JL book. But Superman threatening Lex's life in Action #2 is a bigger deal, in my opinion, given the clear black & white/life vs. murder implication going on there.

Was that after he dropped a guy off the side of a skyscraper in THE VERY FIRST ISSUE?

If this is what "Superman" has been reduced to, I'm glad I will NEVER spend a dime on DC's bullshit ever again.

[thecolorsblend]

I was under the impression that parademons (or the new school versions anyway) are cyborgs or robots or whatever. Destroying them isn't really taking a life, in other words.

Ah, so then we should expect to see this "Superman" kill the following:

Metallo


Brainiac


Amazo


And others? Seeing as how they are either cyborgs or robots?

I don't know about Amazo so much but Superman HAS effectively killed those characters (or at least tried his best to) in comics and other media. Brainiac in at least Smallville, Metallo in cartoons and comics innumerable, threatened to do as much to Bizarro in at least a few Pre-Crisis comics, etc.

Do you really not see the problem with what that panel represents, colors?

It's just Superman smashing shit up in a comic book designed to give Jim Lee the maximum amount of cool stuff to draw. Analyzing it beyond that is probably not a fruitful endeavor.

Was that after he dropped a guy off the side of a skyscraper in THE VERY FIRST ISSUE?

The only thing that's coming to mind here is when he jumped off the side of a building carrying Glenmorgan... who survived.

[webhead2006]

That is a problem there i dont see much harm on a threat cause he could be just playing off who ever he is talking to. But to actually kill is wrong.

[Apologist Puncher]

I don't know about Amazo so much but Superman HAS effectively killed those characters (or at least tried his best to) in comics and other media. Brainiac in at least Smallville, Metallo in cartoons and comics innumerable, threatened to do as much to Bizarro in at least a few Pre-Crisis comics, etc.

Can you site a few examples for us? I don't seem to remember him trying to KILL Metallo OR Brainiac.

So refresh my memory, would you?

It's just Superman smashing shit up in a comic book designed to give Jim Lee the maximum amount of cool stuff to draw. Analyzing it beyond that is probably not a fruitful endeavor.

Ah, so ignore the decapitations and enjoy the pretty colors?

Gotcha.

The only thing that's coming to mind here is when he jumped off the side of a building carrying Glenmorgan... who survived.

You mean THIS?:


Carrying, did you say?

[thecolorsblend]

I don't know about Amazo so much but Superman HAS effectively killed those characters (or at least tried his best to) in comics and other media. Brainiac in at least Smallville, Metallo in cartoons and comics innumerable, threatened to do as much to Bizarro in at least a few Pre-Crisis comics, etc.

Can you site a few examples for us? I don't seem to remember him trying to KILL Metallo OR Brainiac.

So refresh my memory, would you?

Is he actually dead? Well, (A) he looks pretty fucked up to me and (B) he never came back for another episode. So at best, his fate is uncertain.


Try to ignore this faggot putting additional (and unnecessary... and poorly integrated) music into the background.



I'm not minimizing your point. Assuming those are robots or cyborgs or what have you, they're clearly being wiped out. Allz I'm saying is that there's precedent for Superman to take that kind of line about things that aren't "living" in the more strict and traditional sense. But assuming they are living creatures, nothing about Justice League indicates to me that the story aspires to the level of scrutiny to which it is being put.

Ah, so ignore the decapitations and enjoy the pretty colors?

Gotcha.

Pretty much, yeah.

You mean THIS?:


Carrying, did you say?

In other words, yep.

Speaking of Action Comics, as I said, in #2 Superman threatens Lex's life. It's clear cut and unambiguous. I've got a severe problem with that because it certainly look intentional. I want to see that addressed because I can't so easily dismiss the death threat there given how Grant Morrison usually thinks shit out pretty carefully in his writing.

[Apologist Puncher]

Is he actually dead? Well, (A) he looks pretty fucked up to me and (B) he never came back for another episode. So at best, his fate is uncertain.

No, he's not.

Try to ignore this faggot putting additional (and unnecessary... and poorly integrated) music into the background.

But Brainiac came back in Season 10, did he not?

Not dead.

But DID he kill him?

I'm not minimizing your point. Assuming those are robots or cyborgs or what have you, they're clearly being wiped out. Allz I'm saying is that there's precedent for Superman to take that kind of line about things that aren't "living" in the more strict and traditional sense. But assuming they are living creatures, nothing about Justice League indicates to me that the story aspires to the level of scrutiny to which it is being put.

So having "Superman" murder and maim is ok, as long as it's part of a "team book"?

Surely you jest??

Pretty much, yeah.

Sorry, I can't switch into "Apologist" mode. I don't have the proper mental deficiencies to do that.

You mean THIS?:


Carrying, did you say?

In other words, yep.

You DO know those scenes come AFTER the one I posted, right?

You're better than that.

Speaking of Action Comics, as I said, in #2 Superman threatens Lex's life. It's clear cut and unambiguous. I've got a severe problem with that because it certainly look intentional. I want to see that addressed because I can't so easily dismiss the death threat there given how Grant Morrison usually thinks shit out pretty carefully in his writing.

But you are A-Ok with out-and-out killing?

If one doesn't warrant scrutiny or question, something lower on the felony scale should be ignored outright.

Correct?

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