Re: General DC Relaunch Thread (including FAQ)

[thecolorsblend]

The thing that bugs me is that the DCnU Superman has the mother of all handicaps going for it. More and more I believe Superman was retooled with at least half an eye on the Siegel Parasite thing. I can't imagine how it could be otherwise.

But, apart from the name change (which I think most of us could ultimately live with), there's no imperative to retool Captain Marvel. I suppose you could argue that the character hasn't been a major success in his previous incarnation, really, ever in DC's history. But is this type of reimagining the best remedy for that?

If DC does lose Superman in 2013, I'm going to laugh my balls off if Captain Marvel is used to take his place in the DCU. I mean, you'd have a thing where DC is forced to replace their flagship character that got forcibly taken away from them with a flagship character they forcibly took away from somebody else.

Penguin- Tragic irony? Or poetic justice? You tell me.

[non_amos]

[webhead2006]

I wish we could see more of te look. Odd for cloak/cape deal. And I still se no need to name change. And I still wonder with him being called shazam. How will he go about having folks call him that and not switch back into billy, or the opposite.

[webhead2006]

Earth 2 flash/Jay Garrick:
http://www.newsarama.com/comics/james-robinson-describes-earth-2.html

COMICS: First Look At Jay Garrick's New Costume; More Details On "Earth 2" Revealed
The Golden Age Flash will be considerably younger in the planned reboot of "Earth 2" as writer James Robinson reveals plenty of intriguing new details about his plans for the alternate universe's cast of characters.
Josh Wilding - 3/6/2012

In a lengthy interview with Newsarama (which you can find by clicking HERE), writer James Robinson has revealed new details about "Earth 2" as well as a first look at the younger Jay Garrick, who some readers may remember as the elderly Golden Age Flash. During the course of their conversation, he revealed that the upcoming series is a complete reboot of the universe and issue #1 will open with Batman, Superman and Wonder Woman facing off against a threat which sees the emergence of some "familiar faces" who "take the mantles of superheroes in the future." These include "everyman" Jay Garrick, Alan Scott, Al Pratt, Helena Wayne and Karen Starr (although the latter two will soon find themselves on the main DCU Earth as Huntress and Powergirl respectively).

For more details, don't forget to check out the interview with Robinson. Here is the cover for Earth 2 #2 which offers up a first look at Jay Garrick's all-new look.

[non_amos]

That's horrible!

You know how when you tell a lie, you end up having to tell another lie to cover up that one? And before you know it, you've lost track of just what's what! Well, I compare that to what DC is now doing, in a sense. They're trying to rewrite comics history complete with the likes of Jay Gerrick, etc. but imho they're just further screwing everything up! And before you know it they've lost track of exactly what's going on.

[thecolorsblend]

That's horrible!

Can't argue with you there.

[webhead2006]

First he totally looks like he is antman(hey marvel time to sue DC lol) and second i dont really care for the google/helmet deal. Parts of the body suit have some nice stuff, if it wasnt jay gerrick of course. Isnt the deal with him the old school look and what not.

[Apologist Puncher]

http://www.comicbookmovie.com/fansites/rorschachsrants/news/?a=55913

Joe Quesada Says DC's New 52 Is "A Response" To Marvel

While discussing the upcoming Avengers VS X-Men series, chief creative officer of Marvel Entertainment Joe Quesada responds to the theory that this "event" is a response to DC's great success with it's "New 52"..

“Yeah, of course — that’s what people want to think. But let’s be clear: The DC relaunch is a response to everything Marvel’s been doing, and not the other way around. You don’t set fire to your entire house for no good reason. And by the way, I tip my hat to them. They did something daring and it worked for them. They boosted sales of some of their books. But ‘Avengers vs. X-Men’ is something that’s been on our docket for publishing for several years now.”

[thecolorsblend]

"They're doing this to compete with us." Gee, ya think?

Douche...

[Apologist Puncher]

"They're doing this to compete with us." Gee, ya think?

Douche...

I saw this guy talk in person once years and years ago.

You're right.

[thecolorsblend]

Fuck it, I'm coming back to this. I guess the thing that bothers me is that Quesada usually has this anti-DC bullshit he's always slinging and it just gets old. (A) DC never went into bankruptcy, Mr. #1 On The Market and (B) DC *MADE* Quesada back in the 90's. Covers, pin-ups, interior work, all of it. Quesada might've made his bones without DC but he didn't have to. DC basically gave that jerkhole a career. And crap like this is how he says thank you? Ass-nugget. Guy just pisses me off, I'm sorry, but there it is...

[webhead2006]

I just saw that interview myself. I too think joe is a douche also. But that is for other things.

[Apologist Puncher]

http://www.bleedingcool.com/2012/03/19/viva-piracy-says-a-stumped-mark-waid-at-wondercon/

The fan‘s next question: “As the fan everyone know you are (not the writer), the DC’s nu52; what`s your verdict? Liking it, hating, not reading it?” Waid did his best deer in a headlights look, before admitting that he’s not reading them. Not because they’re bad, but because they aren’t made with him as the audience. Just as you’re not going to like every show on the Discovery Channel, or the History Channel, or every comic on the racks in your comic shop, he isn’t the audience that DC is aiming for. Waid admitted that a decade ago, he’d have been overturning tables in a blind fury over this sort of thing, but now he’s a bit more mature. “I do miss my old friends, but they’re safe and sound in my back issues… NO WAIT WHERE HAVE THEY GONE!” screamed Waid, who then began begging for the return of his comics from consignment. In jest. (Blastoffcomics.com is where you can buy them and ensure that Waid never again gets to hold his precious, precious comic book collection.)

[thecolorsblend]

http://www.bleedingcool.com/2012/03/19/viva-piracy-says-a-stumped-mark-waid-at-wondercon/

The fan‘s next question: “As the fan everyone know you are (not the writer), the DC’s nu52; what`s your verdict? Liking it, hating, not reading it?” Waid did his best deer in a headlights look, before admitting that he’s not reading them. Not because they’re bad, but because they aren’t made with him as the audience. Just as you’re not going to like every show on the Discovery Channel, or the History Channel, or every comic on the racks in your comic shop, he isn’t the audience that DC is aiming for. Waid admitted that a decade ago, he’d have been overturning tables in a blind fury over this sort of thing, but now he’s a bit more mature. “I do miss my old friends, but they’re safe and sound in my back issues… NO WAIT WHERE HAVE THEY GONE!” screamed Waid, who then began begging for the return of his comics from consignment. In jest. (Blastoffcomics.com is where you can buy them and ensure that Waid never again gets to hold his precious, precious comic book collection.)

Nice little read. I love Waid. Cool guy. Also, I guess I too have been living under a rock as I had no idea that Irredeemable and Incorruptible were ending in May. I respect him for knowing when it was time to close the door on those titles though.

But to topic, I don't think I buy that there's no redeeming value in the New 52. I've been loving Aquaman, Firestorm and the Lantern titles. No, Superman is maybe not what we'd all like him to be but the whole enterprise has a lot of validity. In fact, my main criticism has been the selective reboots for some characters (Superman, Firestorm, Justice Society of America) but not others (Batman, Swamp Thing, Green Lantern).

[Apologist Puncher]

But to topic, I don't think I buy that there's no redeeming value in the New 52. I've been loving Aquaman, Firestorm and the Lantern titles. No, Superman is maybe not what we'd all like him to be but the whole enterprise has a lot of validity. In fact, my main criticism has been the selective reboots for some characters (Superman, Firestorm, Justice Society of America) but not others (Batman, Swamp Thing, Green Lantern).

Ok, then let me ask you this question:

Do you think they HAD to do what they did, i.e. destroy EVERYTHING that came before, just to tell these stories? Could they not have told them in their long-running books?

[thecolorsblend]

But to topic, I don't think I buy that there's no redeeming value in the New 52. I've been loving Aquaman, Firestorm and the Lantern titles. No, Superman is maybe not what we'd all like him to be but the whole enterprise has a lot of validity. In fact, my main criticism has been the selective reboots for some characters (Superman, Firestorm, Justice Society of America) but not others (Batman, Swamp Thing, Green Lantern).

Ok, then let me ask you this question:

Do you think they HAD to do what they did, i.e. destroy EVERYTHING that came before, just to tell these stories? Could they not have told them in their long-running books?

The JSA, Firestorm and Superman stuff they're doing right now, yeah, they pretty much had to bulldoze the existing continuity to get there. But the Green Lantern, Batman, Flash and other things going on right now... they're more or less continuing that which had come before. I don't see any major difference between what happened in those three series before Flashpoint vs. now. There could be nuances I'm just not getting but at least those three seem to be pretty much unscathed by Flashpoint. People more learned than me argue that Aquaman has been loosely rebooted. There are noticeable differences in terms of continuity between the current Aquaman and the pre-Flashpoint version. Minor differences, to be sure, but they're there. But, in terms of the big picture and the PLOT, I don't see what Aquaman is doing now that would've been drastically impossible following the conclusion of Brightest Day.

But as to the Superman stuff, I listened to a podcast episode a few weeks ago where Marty Pasko was the guest. He's done a lot of comic book writing but he's also been a producer for TV adaptations thereof and therefore has a pretty unique perspective on what might be going on with the New 52. His theory is that the only reason you do something this radical with Superman is for legal purposes of some kind. You can maybe guess where this is going. Pasko theorized that Superman was rebooted in such a way as to make each property (Superman, Supergirl and Superboy) severable from each other if such ever became necessary on a permanent basis. Additionally, he further says that Superman was refined so heavily to intentionally set up what amounts to a whole new character. Both of these issues relate back to the Siegel Parasite lawsuit. The theory goes that DC will argue that the Superman they're publishing now isn't the Superman that they bought from Siegel and Shuster. As such, the Siegel Parasites are entitled to jackshit (or else very very little) since the character is effectively "new". They will use that to win their argument. This is Plan A.

But, should they lose in court, Superboy and Supergirl can now cleanly separated from Superman and DC will at least retain ownership of them and can utilize them in the properties they retain ownership of. This is Plan B.

My point here is the Siegel Parasite case gives Superman one hell of a handicap right now. I don't think you can quite weigh the merits of what's happening now with Superman as easily as you could, say, the Flash. But even on that basis, once you get past that ridiculous bullshit armor he's wearing in the main title, the books have been fairly enjoyable reads. No, not the Superman I'd like to be reading right now, not the reboot I would've preferred or any of a lot of things. But it's an improvement over the Sucky Origin thing we'd been stuck with for years. That does mitigate some of my negativity.

[Apologist Puncher]

But as to the Superman stuff, I listened to a podcast episode a few weeks ago where Marty Pasko was the guest. He's done a lot of comic book writing but he's also been a producer for TV adaptations thereof and therefore has a pretty unique perspective on what might be going on with the New 52. His theory is that the only reason you do something this radical with Superman is for legal purposes of some kind. You can maybe guess where this is going. Pasko theorized that Superman was rebooted in such a way as to make each property (Superman, Supergirl and Superboy) severable from each other if such ever became necessary on a permanent basis. Additionally, he further says that Superman was refined so heavily to intentionally set up what amounts to a whole new character. Both of these issues relate back to the Siegel Parasite lawsuit. The theory goes that DC will argue that the Superman they're publishing now isn't the Superman that they bought from Siegel and Shuster. As such, the Siegel Parasites are entitled to jackshit (or else very very little) since the character is effectively "new". They will use that to win their argument. This is Plan A.

But, should they lose in court, Superboy and Supergirl can now cleanly separated from Superman and DC will at least retain ownership of them and can utilize them in the properties they retain ownership of. This is Plan B.

My point here is the Siegel Parasite case gives Superman one hell of a handicap right now. I don't think you can quite weigh the merits of what's happening now with Superman as easily as you could, say, the Flash. But even on that basis, once you get past that ridiculous bullshit armor he's wearing in the main title, the books have been fairly enjoyable reads. No, not the Superman I'd like to be reading right now, not the reboot I would've preferred or any of a lot of things. But it's an improvement over the Sucky Origin thing we'd been stuck with for years. That does mitigate some of my negativity.

So pretty much, yes. They COULD have done what they did in the MAJORITY of the long-running books. And I think THAT is what Waid is talking about.

As to the Superman stuff, pretty much what we have said from Day 1.....

[thecolorsblend]

Read Justice League #7 on Wednesday. Dug on it. For starters, it's got a bit more of a plot to it than the Darkseid thing had. I'll come back to that in a second though. Basically since most of you probably don't give two craps about spoilers, this issue seems to position Steve Trevor as... well, maybe not a "villain" per sé but something of an antagonist. The basic scenario presented is that Steve Trevor is the Justice League liaison with the federal government. They may not have "... of America" in their title but, let's cut the crap, it's very clearly implied there. They even go so far as to make fun of Justice League International. Anywho, similar to JLU, members of Congress are a little concerned about the Justice League, their orbit, etc. Trevor defends them to the nines but his private thoughts kinda show a different agenda.

When I was at my comic shop the other week, one of the guys there tossed out a conspiracy theory. I wasn't sure if he was joking but the idea he had is that Justice League #1-6 was plotted out Marvel style by Jim Lee, maybe even fully ghost written by him. Then Geoff Johns came in later and added dialogue. Basically, the storyline was done using "the Marvel method" rather than with a full script. As evidence, he pointed to basically everything Geoff Johns has ever written as compared to the Justice League issues at hand. Honestly... well, (A) I'm not sure how serious he was but (B) I just don't know. I guess it could happen but... I dunno. There could be fire underneath all that smoke, esp if you compare them to #7.

Also, and this may be incidental, #7 was drawn by Gene Ha. Jim Lee was nowhere to be found. This could go to support the comic store dude's theory.

Anywho. Apart from the basic gripes (ie, redesigned uniforms), I dug on this issue.

[Apologist Puncher]

Un-named villain for "Justice League", "designed" by Jim Lee... Oh! Look! High collar!!

http://www.comicbookmovie.com/fansites/rorschachsrants/news/?a=56852

[webhead2006]

Man he sure does have the huge collar fetish going and going. But beyond that. That is one wicked odd look. Curious to see what this villain is/does.

[thecolorsblend]

Un-named villain for "Justice League", "designed" by Jim Lee... Oh! Look! High collar!!

http://www.comicbookmovie.com/fansites/rorschachsrants/news/?a=56852

I thought Morbius was a Marvel character.

[Apologist Puncher]

http://www.comicbookmovie.com/fansites/rorschachsrants/news/?a=56852

I thought Morbius was a Marvel character.

It's worse than that:

[webhead2006]

Earth two Alan Scott:
http://www.comicbookmovie.com/fansites/JoshWildingNewsAndReviews/news/?a=57110

COMICS: First Look At "The New 52" EARTH 2 Version Of Alan Scott

Artist Ivan Reis offers up our first look at the modern day re-imagining of this iconic character,while Earth 2 writer James Robinson reveals what we can expect from his take on Alan Scott. Josh Wilding - 3/29/2012

Talking to Comic Book Resources, the writer of the upcoming Earth 2 series (James Robinson) had this to say about his take on Alan Scott. "Alan Scott really is the big guy of Earth-Two. Quite literally. He's very tall, he's dynamic, he's charismatic and he's also the bravest, most gallant man on the planet. He's like the great knight defending the Earth. He would die for his planet, he would die for his people. He is the epitome of what a hero should be. And I think even if he wasn't that way when he first began in the 1940s, he is kind of evolved to that in terms of his place in the Justice Society. I have always felt that he was that character and I have tried to keep that spirit and element of him alive." He goes into much more detail about his plans for this alternate world, so be sure to click on the link below to check it out. For now, here is the debut of Scott on the cover of Earth 2 #3.

[Apologist Puncher]

http://www.bleedingcool.com/2012/04/04/how-the-new-52-toys-have-changed-in-two-and-a-bit-months/

How The New 52 Toys Have Changed In Two-And-A-Bit Months
Written on April 4, 2012 by Rich Johnston in Comics

These were the images of the DC New 52 toys, when released in a flyer by DC Comics in January.



This, however, is how they look in adverts in some of the New DCU titles today (yes, even the likes of Animal Man and Swamp Thing, which just looks weird)



Batman it seems, hasn’t changed a pip. Neither it seems has Aquaman. Superman however has got far more of a smirk on his face, his shield is lifted and his hair is a little more bouffanty. Green Lantern also has a smaller chest logo, and raised. Wonder Woman’s boots have changed colour, she’s got bigger… stars, and her hair has flattened down and extended a bit. Flash also has a little mask work done, and has a bit of a Superman smirk himself now. And Cyborg has been bulked up and now has the biggest collar of them all…

Clearly there has been quite a bit of tinkering.

"Superman" looks like he's perving on everyone he see's, and the "Flash" looks like a cross-eyed retard.

Oh, and look! They added a COLLAR to "Cyborg"!! Jim Lee, you criminal mastermind you!

[webhead2006]

Boy they really didn't need to change them.

[Sponsored content]