Gotham (or "WB/Fox still doesn't have balls to do a REAL comic book TV show")

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Gotham (or "WB/Fox still doesn't have balls to do a REAL comic book TV show")

Post  thecolorsblend on Wed Sep 25, 2013 4:21 pm

IGN wrote:Gotham: Batman's Commissioner Gordon Getting FOX TV Series
by Eric Goldman
September 24, 2013

On the same night Marvel launched Agents of SHIELD, it's been revealed that DC is making another big step in TV, with Commissioner Gordon getting his own live-action series, reveals Deadline. Following a bidding war between the networks, the Warner Bros. TV-produced series, called Gotham, has ended up at FOX. Showing what a big deal Gotham is, it's been given a straight-to-series order, bypassing the pilot stage.

The series will focus on a young Detective James Gordon and "the villains that made Gotham famous." Bruno Heller (Rome, The Mentalist) is writing the Commissioner Gordon, which will presumably launch during the 2014-2015 TV season. Gotham will take place before Gordon meets Batman, who will not be a part of the series.

DC already has one TV show currently on the air, Arrow, and a second is very possible for next year - with The Flash being introduced on Arrow in Season 2 as a potential spinoff character. That being the case, it's possible we could have three DC-based series on the air by next fall.

Source URL- http://www.ign.com/articles/2013/09/25/gotham-batmans-commissioner-gordon-getting-fox-tv-series


Translation- "Don't worry, you civilians out there, this show won't have any scary comic booky costumes or anything to offend your dimwitted, fantasy-averse sensibilities."

Geeze, fuck off and die in a fire already...

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Re: Gotham (or "WB/Fox still doesn't have balls to do a REAL comic book TV show")

Post  non_amos on Thu Sep 26, 2013 1:07 am

I saw a like article over at SHH. Man! Here's a thought. Let's do a TV show about Batman with no Batman. Should sell like hotcakes! Meanwhile, Marvel has the balls to put out Marvel's Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. I know this ain't a thread for that specifically & I haven't had time to make one but I watched the first episode & it was pretty good. The wife even liked it. And Marvel didn't apologize for it being in the same universe as Hulk & Thor for example. 'DC Entertainment' should take a page out of their book. I just wonder how they're gonna justify having Flash on 'Arrow'? You know, the character that should be Green Arrow but they apparently even apologized for that. And duh brothers wonder why Marvel is successful?! Frustration
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Re: Gotham (or "WB/Fox still doesn't have balls to do a REAL comic book TV show")

Post  thecolorsblend on Thu Sep 26, 2013 1:20 am

^ Hey, preaching to the choir, buddy.

Part of me wants to guess that Fox is copying the formula that the WB/CW used for Smallville as a way to keep the budget down. But here's the thing- there was a literary purpose being served in Smallville's no tights/no flights shtick. You don't have to like it; you simply need to accept it as a "Superman comes of age" type of deal. The idea of a teenage Clark learning how to be Superman fit in with the WB/CW formula of a teen drama with pop songs playing in the background. The arc of the show fit the tone of what the WB/CW were shooting for.

That said, it's not like Smallville was ever a cheap show, but the price tag didn't much come down until around season 8. Anybody care to venture that Gordon's show probably won't last that long?

Anyway, I don't see any possible friggin way to apply the same basic Smallville idea to a show about Commissioner Gordon. Very bluntly I'm starting to think nobody knows wtf a police commissioner is even supposed to do because he always gets treated as though he's the chief of police, which is a completely fucking different role in the police department. But apart from that, what will distinguish this show about Gordon from the zillions of other cop dramas out there? The presence of Batman would do it... but, nope, can't have that, he's got a role of some kind in whatever fucking movie DCE is about to puke all over us.

I just have to wonder who this Gordon show is meant to impress. Because it sure as shit isn't me.

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Re: Gotham (or "WB/Fox still doesn't have balls to do a REAL comic book TV show")

Post  thecolorsblend on Wed Jan 15, 2014 8:00 pm

io9 wrote:Fox's Gotham TV series is going to be Batman: The High School Years
Were you hoping that Fox's Batman prequel TV series Gotham would be a tough crime procedural set on the mean streets of Gotham City? Or were you hoping it would be about teenaged Batman, The Joker, Catwoman, Riddler, and the Penguin all hanging out together? Because it's the latter.

Sorry, I threw up in my mouth a little there. Fox chairman Kevin Reilly crushed the dreams of many a Bat-fan at Fox's panel during the network's Television Critics Association press tour earlier today. "This is all of the classic Batman characters," Reilly continued. "It follows the arc of how they all became what they were. I've read the script its really good. It's going to be this operatic soap that has a slightly larger-than-life quality."

Apparently, the plan is exactly like Smallville, in that the show will show how each character, good and bad, become the hero or villain we all know today, and Reilly says the show will end when Batman puts on the cape for the first time.

Original URL- http://io9.com/foxs-gotham-tv-series-is-going-to-be-batman-the-high-1500516368?utm_campaign=socialflow_io9_facebook&utm_source=io9_facebook&utm_medium=socialflow


Several thoughts here.

01- Fuck you, Fox. I mean, really. FUCK YOU. Fuck you and the horse you rode in on. Fuck you for taking the least courageous, least original, least innovative, least ballsy possible approach to bringing Batman back to live action TV. "Remember how much you loved Smallville? Well, we were outbid by the WB on that so here comes the original Batman concept that nobody gives a fuck about anymore."

02- "Prequel"? *sigh* I wish people wouldn't use words they don't know the definitions of. Unless it ties in with some kind of antecedent like Burton, Schumacher, Nolan (although that seems unlikely) or shit even the inevitable reboot based on Affleck's Batman, this show won't be a "prequel". A prequel is what you call a sequel that takes place in an earlier part of an established timeline. By definition it comes LATER.

Temple of Doom? That's a prequel.

The Hobbit? Well, the book at least is NOT a prequel to anything. Not to jackshit. Rather, the Lord of the Rings novels are SEQUELS to the Hobbit. A prequel is released LATER. The Hobbit book came first. This isn't fucking rocket science. This is the fucking definition of the word. Words have meaning. You don't get to reinvent what those meanings are for some fucking piece of shit hipster news update.

03- Did I mention fuck you yet, Fox? If not... fuck you, Fox.

04- This offends me on a lotta levels. Maybe I'll be shown to be wrong. But from where I sit, this looks like a mostly shameless attempt to copy Smallville's formula. Maybe it's because I'm sick to fuck of Batman these days or maybe it's that I like how Smallville is a completely unique concept rather than a formula that can be applied to every dumbass character that seems interesting to some puffed up ignoramus TV exec.

You can't do what Smallville did to just any character. Maybe Daredevil. Hell, maybe even Batman... except I'm sick to fuck of Batman, so there's that. Maybe Wonder Woman, I could kinda see that. But 95% of comic book characters can't stand up to what Smallville did. That's part of what makes Smallville so fucking cool to me.

And it's a big part of why I'm pissed off that was once an innovative and unique idea is being repacked for All Batman, All The Time that 2014 is already shaping up to be.

The other side is that Smallville premiered in a very different time as far as comics go. Back then, "superhero" meant "Batman & Robin" to most people. Smallville took a safe path because that was where the market was at the time. They moved more science-fairy tale stuff into the show as it progressed. It worked for their story and for the purposes of telling stories in a television format and "always keeping things fresh" as the TV mantra goes.

But that was then. This is now. Put on a cape or get out.

05- I wasn't kidding, Fox. FUCK YOU.

06- The one consolation is that nobody (except maybe Kevin Smith and Paul Dini) seems too excited about this. Don't count your blessings before they hatch in the gift horse's mouth or something.

07- You know what? Say whatever you want about Arrow or Nolan's Batman or whatever else. At least they didn't completely turn their backs on the characters' origins. Are they everything I wanted from comics adaptations right now? Maybe not. And yes, they DO have an allergy to comics stuff. But it's not the fantasy-intolerance that Gotham is shaping up to be.

08- I'm really cranky and pissed off for some reason tonight.

09- Oh yeah, fuck you, Fox. Can't remember if I covered that or not.

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Re: Gotham (or "WB/Fox still doesn't have balls to do a REAL comic book TV show")

Post  non_amos on Thu Jan 16, 2014 1:03 am

Ya know, this 'updated' idea really sounds retarded! I mean, I'll take the 'crime drama' of Cop Gordon laying the foundation for Batman over this drivel any day! Did you see that pic? So the entire rogues gallery went to high school with Bruce Wayne? So the Joker was the Joker, before he was the Joker?! I mean, c'mon! Even if you go with 'traditional' Batman canon the Joker had to first become the Joker due to the chemical accident at the hands of Batman, not teenaged Bruce Wayne. Gimme a break! And duh Nolan obviously gave us a Joker that really, to this day, his origin is still a mystery!

Not so in Gotham High. Even Killer Kroc is there, towering over everyone with his reptilian self. And this is a normal day in class? "Oh, but we're aping Smallville, so it'll work." Uh, no, it won't! I suggest going with your own thing. Even ARROW has a 2nd season now & for some reason it's popular. I have a feeling if this report is true then 'Gotham' won't be on the air very long. Mercifully. And whatever happened to WB's refusal to let there be any new Batman on TV due to the film franchise? Now that Nolan is gone is it 'anything goes'?

You're right about Smallville though. The producers I suppose could've gone with the traditional SUPERBOY approach, much like the previous TV series did. I mean, the film franchise was in 'development hell' forever & a day' so it's not like they'd have been hindered, right? But instead they chose a different path, a coming of age' for Superman like you pointed out. And not a path where Clark got there the next day either. But like you said, it was unique. It's not gonna work as a 'generic' solution for 'one size fits all'.

As for Batman, if they were gonna have a TV series at all, I don't see why they couldn't just go with a weekly show where Batman is fighting a different villain every week. I know it couldn't be big budget like the films but does everything have to be big budget? The TV show would focus mainly on stuff like story & character development anyway & since it's Batman it's not like they'd need a huge CGI budget. Just make a little gritty & not campy like the 60's version & we could have a winner.

But duh idiots wont do that though.  Suspect
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Re: Gotham (or "WB/Fox still doesn't have balls to do a REAL comic book TV show")

Post  thecolorsblend on Thu Jan 16, 2014 3:09 am

non_amos wrote:Ya know, this 'updated' idea really sounds retarded! I mean, I'll take the 'crime drama' of Cop Gordon laying the foundation for Batman over this drivel any day! Did you see that pic? So the entire rogues gallery went to high school with Bruce Wayne? So the Joker was the Joker, before he was the Joker?! I mean, c'mon! Even if you go with 'traditional' Batman canon the Joker had to first become the Joker due to the chemical accident at the hands of Batman, not teenaged Bruce Wayne. Gimme a break! And duh Nolan obviously gave us a Joker that really, to this day, his origin is still a mystery!

Not so in Gotham High. Even Killer Kroc is there, towering over everyone with his reptilian self. And this is a normal day in class? "Oh, but we're aping Smallville, so it'll work." Uh, no, it won't! I suggest going with your own thing. Even ARROW has a 2nd season now & for some reason it's popular. I have a feeling if this report is true then 'Gotham' won't be on the air very long. Mercifully. And whatever happened to WB's refusal to let there be any new Batman on TV due to the film franchise? Now that Nolan is gone is it 'anything goes'?
Actually I think that's probably their mindset. And to look at it from their point of view, they made a cumulative nearly $3 billion off the Nolanverse during the theatrical run. There's good reason to believe that Nolan's Batman is definitive for this generation and while Ben Affleck may eventually be accepted as A Batman, Christian Bale will always be THE Batman for some people. And whatever, my generation had 2.5 Batmen (Keaton, Kilmer and Clooney) so who am I to take Bale away from anybody? Just saying that WB got what they wanted with Nolan's trilogy so they probably will be more lax about this shit going forward. If Smallville had continued to season 11 or 12 as a TV show (rather than a comic), I'd be amazed if Bruce wasn't included on the show in some form or another. The coast was clear by that point, you know?

non_amos wrote:You're right about Smallville though. The producers I suppose could've gone with the traditional SUPERBOY approach, much like the previous TV series did. I mean, the film franchise was in 'development hell' forever & a day' so it's not like they'd have been hindered, right? But instead they chose a different path, a coming of age' for Superman like you pointed out. And not a path where Clark got there the next day either. But like you said, it was unique. It's not gonna work as a 'generic' solution for 'one size fits all'.

As for Batman, if they were gonna have a TV series at all, I don't see why they couldn't just go with a weekly show where Batman is fighting a different villain every week. I know it couldn't be big budget like the films but does everything have to be big budget? The TV show would focus mainly on stuff like story & character development anyway & since it's Batman it's not like they'd need a huge CGI budget. Just make a little gritty & not campy like the 60's version & we could have a winner.

But duh idiots wont do that though.  Suspect
The art there comes from a proposed Batman animated series that ended up getting discontinued during the conceptual stage in favor of that Beware the Batman thing (which I think just got cancelled). My understanding is that the series we're talking about here will be live action. I could kinda warm up to the idea of a waaaaaaaaaay over the top, animated high school Batman show. I feel like I've already gotten my definitive animated Batman show in BTAS. I don't need something bigger better faster more. So a zany animated show with all the characters in high school together could be kinda fun. Doubt I'd watch much of it but the concept of it doesn't morally offend me.

But the original "early Bruce" thing that evolved into Smallville does because the market's moved on since 2001. Bryan Singer couldn't have made his first X-Men movie too much like the comics because it was against the public mood at the time. But now Marvel's gearing up for Guardians of the Galaxy, featuring a walking tree and a talking squirrel with a fucking machine gun. The non-costume thing just smacks of insecurity with the subject matter. And like I said, that made sense about 15 years ago. But tastes change and wide audiences have a much bigger appetite for comic book mythos than they once did.

The prevailing school of thought right now, according to Paul Dini, is that children will only respond to characters that are their age. The thinking goes that the characters they see on TV must be a precise match for their own experiences and points of view or else they'll just tune out. Wonder why so many animated shows center on kids now vs. thirty years ago? That's why. Maybe the bigwigs are right about this, maybe they're not, but that's how that animated Gotham High thing didn't get laughed out of the boardroom. Someone saw disco potential with an animated show like that but I guess cooler heads prevailed (in a sense) so we got that Beware the Batman thing instead.

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Re: Gotham (or "WB/Fox still doesn't have balls to do a REAL comic book TV show")

Post  Comicbookfan-V2 on Sun Jan 19, 2014 10:52 am

You know after hearing about Fox requiring the rights to do a "Batman" related show except it'll be a crime-drama/cop series involving Commissioner Gordan & the Gotham PD I was like... Really??! They're actually going forward with this? And I'm not even going to ask, what were they thinking cause it's just not worth losing my breath over! I bet it has something to do with "Marvel's Agents of Shield" doesn't it?

thecolorsblend wrote:But the original "early Bruce" thing that evolved into Smallville does because the market's moved on since 2001.

Speaking of which, this is something I have heard of and would actually prefer over than what Fox is planning since it was going to be a series involving Bruce's upbringings & training to be what he'll eventually become. Of course it'll require him to travel around the world before he even returns to Gotham after he requires what he'll be needing. And as an additional idea (From my own wishful thinking), feature Meanwhile moments that is going on in Gotham as secondary stories focusing on Gordan and or either Alfred. Shouldn't be that hard right? RIGHT??!


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Re: Gotham (or "WB/Fox still doesn't have balls to do a REAL comic book TV show")

Post  thecolorsblend on Sun Jan 19, 2014 7:41 pm

I dunno. I've never really been big on the idea of the pre-Batman Bruce show. You can do shit like that because it doesn't take much imagination to make that concept work with Superman. But with Batman, you're stuck with a situation where Bruce has to do a lot of traveling (which costs money for the production), faces his future enemies and they somehow don't connect Bruce to Batman later in life in spite of how famous Bruce already is and doing a lot of moping and whining. On my best day, the most I could think of is two or three seasons at most.

And Smallville had an agenda. No tights/no flights. That was a barrier Clark had to reach. Once he exceeded that barrier, the show ended. But what similar barrier does Bruce have to overcome?

I just never saw it. I think whoever made this call did the right thing by making it a Superman show. I didn't care to see a pre-Batman show then and don't care to now.

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Re: Gotham (or "WB/Fox still doesn't have balls to do a REAL comic book TV show")

Post  Comicbookfan-V2 on Tue Jan 21, 2014 6:16 am

This is for those who not yet got the memo...

Flicksided.com wrote:When the new Gotham TV series was announced back in 2013, many people were wondering just what the show would be about. At first, it was being described as an origin story for Jim Gordon’s character but that has now expanded to FOX saying classic batman villains will be involved as well.

Now the network is confirming what we all believed from the start, as Fox chairman Kevin Reilly announced this week that Gotham will tell the arc of Bruce Wayne from 12-year old orphan to his birth as Batman in the final episodes of the series.

While a television series following Jim Gordon would have been interesting to see, fans  no doubt want to see as much Batman as they can, an Gotham is now developing into a re-telling of the character’s origin story. There’s no details on if the series will be based off of any specific comic books, or if the story will be totally original from the start, but the show will include plenty of Bruce Wayne which is sure to draw the audience FOX is expecting.

Personally, I think my interest meter has suddenly gone up cause I'd definitely prefer going with this direction over a series focus solely on the Gotham PD! Now if only this would have any connections to the DC Cinematic Universe!
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Re: Gotham (or "WB/Fox still doesn't have balls to do a REAL comic book TV show")

Post  non_amos on Tue Jan 21, 2014 8:38 am

Yeah but just exactly how are they gonna screw this whole thing up in the process? Smallville worked. Gothamville? Meh. Don't know about that. But at least SV took a unique approach on Superman & it paid off with 10 seasons + the comic book! Now that doesn't mean I agree with everything SV did but as a whole I really dug the show. I mean, they threw elements of Donnerverse in there but also did their own thing. I'm glad MOS did their own thing period!

This talk of Bruce fighting all his enemies before he's Batman doesn't just remind me of SV but there's an aspect of this that even reminds me of the new SPIDERMAN film franchise. How so? Namely in secret identity. I really like the direction they're taking the new Spiderman but..........as far as villains go, why does it seem like everyone and their cousin knows that Spiderman is Peter Parker?! Does anyone else here get that impression? It's like they're all really gunning for Peter Parker, supposedly due to whatever that 'secret' is. But that's a discussion for another thread.

So why do I compare this to the 'Batman' TV series? Well, picture this. Bruce ain't even Batman yet but he's having to fight Joker, Penguin, etc., & they're no doubt 'gunning for Bruce Wayne'. See what I mean? And when Bruce does become Batman, it's no secret. Of course there's SV comparisons here too but at least it worked there. Here? Not so sure about that.
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Re: Gotham (or "WB/Fox still doesn't have balls to do a REAL comic book TV show")

Post  thecolorsblend on Tue Jan 21, 2014 7:14 pm

Feels like I should clarify on something. My opposition to this thing comes from the fact that I simply don't care to watch an idea this derivative of Smallville. But if other people are jazzed about it, great. So I hope the fans love the two or three seasons of it Fox gives you before they cancel it in favor of something else. Because, hey, it's Fox.

Enjoy!

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Re: Gotham (or "WB/Fox still doesn't have balls to do a REAL comic book TV show")

Post  Apologist Puncher on Fri Feb 21, 2014 1:37 am

http://www.comicbookmovie.com/fansites/notyetamovie/news/?a=94818

Prepare for a shock guys, because Deadline report that Jada Pinkett Smith will play a female version of The Joker in Fox's Gotham Series! Okay, not really - she'll actually be playing an original character not based on anyone from the DC Comics named 'Fish Mooney', who's described as "an imposing, hotheaded and notoriously sadistic gangster boss and nightclub owner with street smarts and almost extra-sensory abilities to read people like an open book who is not one to be crossed". If the name is familiar it's because Mooney was mentioned as the arch-villain whom Robin Lord Taylor's Oswald Cobblepot (aka The Penguin) will be working for. Interesting casting to say the least I'm sure you'll agree. Bruno Heller (The Mentalist, Rome) wrote the pilot script and will serve as executive producer on Gotham, Danny Cannon (CSI, Nikita) directing the pilot which is expected to air this fall.

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Re: Gotham (or "WB/Fox still doesn't have balls to do a REAL comic book TV show")

Post  thecolorsblend on Fri Feb 21, 2014 1:44 am

I can't claim laziness on this. I just plain forgot to post it. Apologies.

Jada Pinkett Smith is literally the very first piece of good news I've heard about Gotham. Now, you could argue that this maybe the Smiths trying to overcome (A) Jada's lack of a big role in a long time and (B) Will's lackluster performance this summer. But either way, I don't see her casting as bad news.

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Re: Gotham (or "WB/Fox still doesn't have balls to do a REAL comic book TV show")

Post  Apologist Puncher on Tue May 06, 2014 8:49 pm


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Re: Gotham (or "WB/Fox still doesn't have balls to do a REAL comic book TV show")

Post  thecolorsblend on Tue May 06, 2014 11:09 pm

There was a time when I would've loved a show like this. But these days (A) it's been done (B) it's been done better and (C) I'm fed up with everybody's boner for Batman.

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Re: Gotham (or "WB/Fox still doesn't have balls to do a REAL comic book TV show")

Post  Apologist Puncher on Thu Jun 19, 2014 6:42 pm


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Re: Gotham (or "WB/Fox still doesn't have balls to do a REAL comic book TV show")

Post  non_amos on Thu Jun 19, 2014 11:39 pm

Where's the sound? It wasn't on Youtube either.
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Re: Gotham (or "WB/Fox still doesn't have balls to do a REAL comic book TV show")

Post  Apologist Puncher on Fri Oct 31, 2014 7:11 pm

Since it's not technically a "Batman" show, I moved this to it's own forum.

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