General DC Relaunch Thread (including FAQ)

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Re: General DC Relaunch Thread (including FAQ)

Post  thecolorsblend on Wed Aug 31, 2011 4:18 pm

thecolorsblend wrote:Picked up Flashpoint #5 and Justice League #1 at a midnight sale my LCS had last night.

Justice League? Not bad. It centers mostly on Green Lantern meeting Batman and then they head over to Metropolis where Superman gets the drop on them.

So. The basic concept here is that Batman has been operating in secret for years while Superman is once again the first superhero... to work in the open.

It's one of those things that works okay, I guess, as long as you don't think about it too much. But if you understand that the decision was made to protect all of Batman's continuity (he's not changing much, if at all), you're left with a lot of questions. If Batman has operated in secret all these years, who the hell do the citizens of Gotham City credit with capturing villains like the Joker? All previous stories are in continuity, right? So that means it was the Joker who shot Barbara (her history is in tact), killed Jason Todd, so on and so on. You also have to account for Dick's stint as Robin, Jason's stint as Robin (and subsequent murder), Batman going solo (and hardcore) for a while, Tim Drake coming into the fold, everything between 1993 to, what, at least 2000 or so (in terms of comics published during those years). That's a lot of shit to cover and I find it hard to believe that could all have been done in secret.

Basically, Green Lantern and Batman have been DC's most reliable performers the past few years. DC would understandably want to protect them during a hard reboot like Flashpoint but partial reboots DON'T WORK. The reason is because it leads to problems like the above.

My beef is not so much that they're doing a hard reboot... it's that they're NOT doing a hard reboot. GL and Batman will stay basically the same... which works okay for their individual titles but it damages the shit out of their place in the DCnU.

Justice League #1 is good unto itself, perhaps, but this rebooted continuity is destined to have as many problems as the previous one did because of the lack of coherence between the titles.

EDIT- I left out something crucial here. Basically DCnU is built on the proposition that superheroes only became came out into the open "five years ago" (in comic book time; I guess it'll be a perpetually floating timeline). The reason Batman is a problem is because he has a metric fuckton of history and it seems too unwieldy to fit into a five year history of superheroes operating in the open, thus he had to have been operating in secret some years prior.

But this notion creates more continuity issues than it solves.
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Re: General DC Relaunch Thread (including FAQ)

Post  Apologist Puncher on Wed Aug 31, 2011 9:36 pm


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Re: General DC Relaunch Thread (including FAQ)

Post  webhead2006 on Wed Aug 31, 2011 9:59 pm

is that really from the book or just a mockup?
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Re: General DC Relaunch Thread (including FAQ)

Post  thecolorsblend on Wed Aug 31, 2011 10:01 pm

webhead2006 wrote:is that really from the book or just a mockup?
...

What do you think?
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Re: General DC Relaunch Thread (including FAQ)

Post  webhead2006 on Wed Aug 31, 2011 10:04 pm

boy they really did have to have every book ending with some nod off to the DCnU huh.
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Re: General DC Relaunch Thread (including FAQ)

Post  thecolorsblend on Thu Sep 01, 2011 12:30 am

thecolorsblend wrote:
thecolorsblend wrote:Picked up Flashpoint #5 and Justice League #1 at a midnight sale my LCS had last night.

Justice League? Not bad. It centers mostly on Green Lantern meeting Batman and then they head over to Metropolis where Superman gets the drop on them.

So. The basic concept here is that Batman has been operating in secret for years while Superman is once again the first superhero... to work in the open.

It's one of those things that works okay, I guess, as long as you don't think about it too much. But if you understand that the decision was made to protect all of Batman's continuity (he's not changing much, if at all), you're left with a lot of questions. If Batman has operated in secret all these years, who the hell do the citizens of Gotham City credit with capturing villains like the Joker? All previous stories are in continuity, right? So that means it was the Joker who shot Barbara (her history is in tact), killed Jason Todd, so on and so on. You also have to account for Dick's stint as Robin, Jason's stint as Robin (and subsequent murder), Batman going solo (and hardcore) for a while, Tim Drake coming into the fold, everything between 1993 to, what, at least 2000 or so (in terms of comics published during those years). That's a lot of shit to cover and I find it hard to believe that could all have been done in secret.

Basically, Green Lantern and Batman have been DC's most reliable performers the past few years. DC would understandably want to protect them during a hard reboot like Flashpoint but partial reboots DON'T WORK. The reason is because it leads to problems like the above.

My beef is not so much that they're doing a hard reboot... it's that they're NOT doing a hard reboot. GL and Batman will stay basically the same... which works okay for their individual titles but it damages the shit out of their place in the DCnU.

Justice League #1 is good unto itself, perhaps, but this rebooted continuity is destined to have as many problems as the previous one did because of the lack of coherence between the titles.

EDIT- I left out something crucial here. Basically DCnU is built on the proposition that superheroes only became came out into the open "five years ago" (in comic book time; I guess it'll be a perpetually floating timeline). The reason Batman is a problem is because he has a metric fuckton of history and it seems too unwieldy to fit into a five year history of superheroes operating in the open, thus he had to have been operating in secret some years prior.

But this notion creates more continuity issues than it solves.

Seems I'm not the only one wondering about this.

Ed Brubaker's facebook wrote:One thing I'm puzzled by. If Batmans only been around a few years, how does he have three previous Robins already?

URL- https://www.facebook.com/permalink.php?story_fbid=10150290721518700&id=20928103699


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Re: General DC Relaunch Thread (including FAQ)

Post  thecolorsblend on Thu Sep 01, 2011 12:50 pm

thecolorsblend wrote:Here's another one.

DCU Blog wrote:The Justice Society

Saturday, August 27th, 2011

By Josh Kushins

There’s been plenty of speculation about the Justice Society in The New 52 – and we can now confirm that they will, in fact, be back! As with everything else with DC Comics – The New 52, however, there’s a significant twist. What is it? We’re not saying. Just. Quite. Yet.

"It’s everything you want, but not what you expect," promises Eddie Berganza, DC Comics Executive Editor.

Stay tuned to THE SOURCE as this develops, as they say.

URL- http://dcu.blog.dccomics.com/2011/08/27/the-justice-society/


My hunch is that the JSA will be returned to Earth-2. This opens up almost as many doors as it closes. It allows them to keep their World War II roots (which, admittedly, was an important element in their history) and also characters like Superman, Batman and others can be on the team without totally jacking up the mainline continuity.

There's nothing that says they can't visit Earth-1 occasionally though and still serve as a guiding force for the modern heroes.
Another theory I've seen is that the JSA CHARACTERS will be running around the DCnU but the TEAM will only come together after (if ever) the Justice League of America starts up. Prior to then, and like Batman, they'll have been operating on the down-low. And there's some juice to that idea. You could argue that perhaps FDR wanted to keep their involvement in WW2 on a need-to-know basis as they were originally to have been a secret weapon against the Axis powers.

Anyway. It's a thought.
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Re: General DC Relaunch Thread (including FAQ)

Post  thecolorsblend on Thu Sep 01, 2011 7:05 pm

Since I'm blathering here, one thing that I guess never soaked through until I read Flashpoint #5 was that the DCnU merges the existing mainstream DC continuity with the Vertigo line and also the Wildstorm universe. Obvious, really, given the blatant solicits out there (Grifter, Animal Man, etc) but I guess I needed to see it happen before I really got it.

I didn't give a shit about Wildstorm back in the 90's and nothing much has changed there. But Vertigo? Dunno. Always felt like those characters and concepts worked better when isolated from DC's mainstream superhero stuff. And not for their benefit necessarily so much as I thought a universe including both the Phantom Stranger and Gaiman's Sandman was kinda stupid. But, for better or for worse, comics long ago outgrew the Comics Code so there's an argument that a "mature readers" line is sort of redundant nowadays. Dunno.

So whatever.
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Re: General DC Relaunch Thread (including FAQ)

Post  non_amos on Mon Sep 26, 2011 12:37 am

For those who give a crap:

http://www.ifc.com/sweepstakes/dc-comics/

This is a sweepstakes to win all 52 #1's of the DCnU. There'll be 10 winners & it only lasts until the end of October. You can enter once per day. Just thought I'd share this in case anyone wants to enter. If you win & don't want it, you can always sell it on eBay.
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Re: General DC Relaunch Thread (including FAQ)

Post  thecolorsblend on Fri Sep 30, 2011 3:10 am

This is a side of the bidness I don't usually pay much attention to but here are some remarks about The New 52 "sell out" titles.

http://www.newsarama.com/comics/new-52-sold-out-but-is-it-selling-110929.html

For mood music as you read that page...

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Re: General DC Relaunch Thread (including FAQ)

Post  webhead2006 on Fri Sep 30, 2011 8:49 am

Interesting read there man, ya what a load it is huh. Sure they are selling but really not selling. Lets see where things really are once they get a few months in.
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Re: General DC Relaunch Thread (including FAQ)

Post  thecolorsblend on Fri Sep 30, 2011 11:57 am

Picked up several more #1's yesterday. Superman, Aquaman, Teen Titans, The Dark Knight, Firestorm and The Flash.

Superman? Well, the writing and the art wasn't too bad. I thought Perez gave maybe one shout out too many to his comic convention fans... but then, given that I know many of those same people, perhaps I'm more sensitive to it than the average person would be. The costume... oh, that costume... but apart from that, it really wasn't bad at all.

Aquaman was good too. I've never bought an Aquaman comic before and know basically zero about the character but I dug this issue. Seemed to establish the big picture of who Aquaman is while also setting up a storyline that looks kinda cool.

Haven't read the other #1's yet so I can't tell you much there. The main reason I picked up the Titans book though is because Superboy #1 was so good and seemed to lead right into Teen Titans #1. So why not give it a shot, right?
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Re: General DC Relaunch Thread (including FAQ)

Post  thecolorsblend on Sat Oct 15, 2011 2:51 am

Can't believe I over-looked this but here goes anyway. This is a pretty surprising update about the Justice Society of America but it fits with some speculations I've made.



In case that's too small or hard to read...

Eddie Berganza, DC Comics All-Access wrote:Ok, we told you last month that September was only the beginning! And here we are now entering the second month of the New 52!

And "two" becomes a very important number in an unexpected way as writer James Robinson revealed to a stunned crowd at Fan Expo Canada, he will be writing a JUSTICE SOCIETY series drawn by Nicola Scott that takes place on...wait for it...Earth-2!

What does that mean? Well, it means a world parallel to the current DC Earth. But what's parallel and who's on it, only time will tell or maybe there will be hints of things to come in the HUNTRESS mini that's on sale now! It's written by the character's creator Paul Levitz and drawn by the amazing Marcus To (don't take my word for it, look at the art on this page). As originally conceived, Helena was the daughter of two very cool and special people. Two people we knew, but they weren't from here. The Batman and Catwoman of Earth-2. Not bad parentage, and it made Huntress a very aggressive hero with a unique point of view.

Now as we get further into the all-new world of the New 52, you'll have to check out the 6-issue mini to find out where she really comes from. In that regard, I also say pick up MR. TERRIFIC by Eric Wallace and Gianluca Gugliotta. In that book, Michael Holt's relationship with Karen Starr could have some interesting developments.

As been noted, we're just getting revved up!

--Eddie Berganza
Executive Editor
A couple of things.

First, the JSA series taking place on Earth-2 doesn't necessarily mean that they're native to Earth-2, as was the case in the old Pre-Crisis days. There's some history there but to keep it short, the JSA only existed in the same universe as the mainstream DC characters AFTER the Crisis.

Second, that did a lot of damage to many Earth-2 characters and concepts. Sure, it strengthened the legacy aspect of the DCU. No doubts there. But it REALLY destroyed the Huntress and Power Girl. I don't think either ever fully recovered from Crisis. The Huntress, as per the above, was originally the daughter of Batman and Catwoman from Earth-2. Helena Wayne. Well, the minute you insert here into the same universe as the mainstream Batman, that has to change. (A) She's an adult, which means you have to radically age Bruce Wayne and, thus, radically age the rest of the JLA and (B) the conventional wisdom at the time was that nobody wanted the mainstream Batman to have children. But, with respect to Damien Wayne, that was then, this is now. I guess.

As for Power Girl, she was basically Supergirl of Earth-2... a whiny, malcontent, bitchy, obnoxious feminist version of Supergirl. Given that there's already a Kara/Supergirl for Earth-1, exactly wtf are you supposed to do with Power Girl?

All this to say that restoring the JSA as native Earth-2 characters has TONS of possibility. Sort of like Marvel's Ultimate line, the beauty of Earth-2 is that you can take risks and chances there that you couldn't necessarily get away with in the mainstream continuity. Case in point- the Earth-2 Batman was killed off (permanently) and subsequent stories were a lot more dramatic and interesting as a result. But you still had the safety net of Earth-1 Batman appearing in Detective Comics and his self-titled book month in and month out. It's the best way to have your cake and eat it too.

So if that's where this is going, hey, I'm all for it. Yeah, you lose some of the legacy stuff that I cherish about the DCU in the 80's, 90's and 2000's but you regain (A) Superman as the first superhero (in public at least) and (B) the sense of possibility Earth-2 was always intended to have.

This could be VERY interesting.
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Re: General DC Relaunch Thread (including FAQ)

Post  Apologist Puncher on Mon Oct 17, 2011 9:06 pm

Captain Marvel to get the "52" treatment.

http://comicbookmovie.com/fansites/JakeLester/news/?a=48363

Over the weekend I posted a story that Captain Marvel would be making his way in to DC's new 52. Now, thanks to Newsarma, we have a few more details regarding young Billy Batson's triumphant return.

As previously stated SHAZAM will not be getting his own title, but will be getting a back up story in Justice League. The story be entitled The Curse Of Shazam, and will placed behind the Justice Leagues main story. The Curse of Shazam will begin in Justice League #5, which will be out in January. Artist Gary Frank spoke of his on his enthusiasm for the project and the character saying, The whole thing is being done from the point of view of bringing in new fans as well as trying to excite the existing ones. Anyone will be able to pick this up even if they have never heard of Shazam, Captain Marvel or Billy Batson. It's a wonderful character. As pure a story of superhero wish-fulfillment as exists."

Expect to see Captain Marvel is a different costume as well, but don't expect it to be like any of the other superhero redesigns that we have seen so far. "Both Geoff and I were keen that our costume should look different to the rest of the Justice League's costumes since it comes from a different place," said Frank. No final decision has been made on the costume yet, but they want the suit to feel classic with Frank saying, "We're still ironing it out but, whereas the other costumes feel very modern and cool, ours needs to feel timeless and, hopefully, cool. We are dealing with magic rather than tailoring, so this has to be in there somehow."

Frank also touched briefly on how he came to love the character of Captain Marvel, siting Mark Waid and Alex Ross's Kingdom Come as his inspiration. "I absolutely love Mark's take on the character, even though we really only see the true Billy Batson for a second or two before he dies. But on every page you can feel him and his history. It's all there in the way he is perceived. I love the fact that there is an unease among the other heroes to be in the presence of that much power." Frank also anticipates fan backlash from some of the changes that he and Johns are making to the character, saying he is aware of conservative fans who are skeptical about radical new approaches, but assures people they are not trying to destroy the characters but rather keep them fresh so that they can stick around for further generations.

That bold part is both laughable and insulting.

Think about it.

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Re: General DC Relaunch Thread (including FAQ)

Post  thecolorsblend on Mon Oct 17, 2011 11:00 pm

There's nothing wrong with Captain Marvel's costume. There are legal arguments you can make for changing Superman's outfit but Captain Marvel's? No way.

As ever, Geoff Johns and Gary Frankenstein can both kiss my ass.
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Re: General DC Relaunch Thread (including FAQ)

Post  webhead2006 on Tue Oct 18, 2011 6:17 am

I totally agree there is no need to change cap marvel look. Thhat old timey look really fits the character and his powers. Only time I ever expected a costume change would have been if a film got off the ground. Since comics to screen suits do tend to change.
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Re: General DC Relaunch Thread (including FAQ)

Post  thecolorsblend on Tue Oct 18, 2011 12:36 pm

webhead2006 wrote:I totally agree there is no need to change cap marvel look. Thhat old timey look really fits the character and his powers. Only time I ever expected a costume change would have been if a film got off the ground. Since comics to screen suits do tend to change.
And that's the thing, I don't see anything old fashioned about the Captain's suit. It's got some flair to it but no more and no less than a lot of other superhero costumes. Moreover, of all superheroes, Captain Marvel has the absolute least in common with your more realistic characters. Of all superheroes, he should be the one that really pushes the fantasy angle.

As ever, it's as though Johns and Frankenstein can't see the forest for the trees.

And something else? I'd rather they finish Batman fucking Earth One already before they start worrying about other projects. One thing at a time. But, hell, maybe I'm the one who's old fashioned here. Fuckin hacks...
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Re: General DC Relaunch Thread (including FAQ)

Post  webhead2006 on Tue Oct 18, 2011 1:30 pm

Ya I see your point there. And really they should work on one or two things at most and then just get others on other projects. Hell johns is probably one of the most busist guys for dc being the head ceative dude and still write books on top of that.
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Re: General DC Relaunch Thread (including FAQ)

Post  thecolorsblend on Tue Oct 18, 2011 7:02 pm

webhead2006 wrote:Ya I see your point there. And really they should work on one or two things at most and then just get others on other projects. Hell johns is probably one of the most busist guys for dc being the head ceative dude and still write books on top of that.
Fuck that noise, jack. Geoff Johns was one of the most tardy writers in the business even BEFORE he became DC's creative whatever. Anybody who says otherwise just doesn't know what he's talking about.

Here's the thing, nobody would even notice tardiness if DC was more careful about solicits. If they were to wait until, say, the first five parts of a six issue miniseries were completely done and in the can before they solicited issue #1, giving everybody involved the benefit of NO doubt, Johns and whichever penciller would have eight months to finish one comic book (a three month lead time in the solicit plus one issue per month for five months; 5+3=8 ). Easy peezy! This shit about announcing/soliciting something a fucking year in advance, when work has barely started on the script for the first issue, is bullshit. That may work in the film biz (where it's your ass if you're late for something) but, try though those ignorant sons of bitches might to change things, COMIC BOOKS ARE NOT FILM. Period.

Batman- Earth One is a prime example. They announced that thing, what, a year and a half or more ago? I don't even remember what the fucking release date is anymore. The PERCEPTION is that it's taking forever to finish simply because we've known about it for so long without any real update to it. It doesn't matter if that's even true or not, IT'S HOW THINGS LOOK.

So no, I don't buy into poor widdle Geoff Johns being ovew-wowked. (A) He agreed to the deadlines and (B) nobody has a gun to DC's head forcing them to announce and solicit shit this far in advance.

Sorry dude, but your entire point is pretty much bullshit.
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Re: General DC Relaunch Thread (including FAQ)

Post  thecolorsblend on Sun Oct 30, 2011 5:42 am

There have been several stand outs from The New 52 so far.

-- Superman family of titles
Once you get past the redesigned outfit, the two Superman books have been enjoyable reads. Nowadays, you could argue that only two issues of anything is too new to rate. But so far, I've really enjoyed them, esp Action Comics (which seems to be what DC is really hyping for whatever reason). The t-shirt/jeans thing in Action Comics works for me. I'd be okay if Action Comics was made into an ongoing "early adventures" thing on for the foreseeable future but from what I've gathered, it's apparently a six issue arc that Morrison has planned before Superman's powers and costume begin to line up with what's going on with the main Superman title. Oh well. I'll keep following both. For the first time in years, I'm collecting the Superman books again. Wonders will never cease...

Supergirl has been okay. One controversial thing has been that Supergirl will apparently develop a power that Superman doesn't have. This has given the Apologists no end of fits. Frankly though, I buy it. This is actually something I've advocated on an even bigger scale for quite some time. To me, it makes sense that yellow sun radiation would have different effects on different people depending upon their individual biology. So one Kryptonian might develop the ability to fly while a different one might become invisible or something. Apart from mixing up the superpowers, it gives the writers room for wild card superpowers. If anything, my "criticism" here is that this concept isn't being taken further. Even so, I doubt I'll continue following this title.

Superboy has been really good. I've not liked Connor ever since Geoff Johns got his hands on him. What we've got here is basically a completely brand new character. He's got the same basic origin (cooked up in a lab) but much different superpowers than Superman. He also doesn't have too much of a conscience yet so the obvious character for him to start out is developing one. I've been really enjoying this. I'll probably keep collecting it.

Teen Titans technically isn't a Superman book but it has to go somewhere and since Superboy will eventually join the team, I'm putting this here. I've been really enjoying the Titans. I like the concept of NOWHERE and Tim being forced to pull the Titans together as much for their own survival as anything. It may be a relic from the old continuity but I've wondered why he hasn't gone to Batman for help in this. It makes Tim a stronger character to do it on his own but, still, we're talking life and death here. So hmm. Not sure if I'll keep following this. I REALLY dig this take on Tim but that may not be enough to make me stick around.

-- Green Lantern
I should start off by saying that over the past week or so, I've read practically the entire run of the old series by Geoff Johns. I've always griped about Hal Jordan being a cardboard cutout of a character but, in truth, that outlook was based on the pre-Johns version. I was expecting his take to be more or less than the bland non-character I remembered from the Superfriends and the 70's, 80's and (arguably) 90's comics but that's not the case. Johns has essentially reimagined Hal as a bit of Han Solo figure. Slightly rogueish, kind of a pussyhound and a general reckless streak. Overall? Hey, I'm man enough to admit I was wrong. I REALLY dug the Johns version of Hal.

In relation to the New 52, not too much has changed. Basically the GL stories in this new continuity are picking up where the old series left off.

I've not read the Red Lantern series (and probably won't) but The New Guardians might have the most potential so far. The basic concept is that Kyle somehow gets chosen by rings from each Corps (except Green Lantern, of which he was already a member) simultaneously. The thrust here is that we'll see what effect each ring has on him over the long haul. Like any good team title nowadays, the "team" here is anything but friendly toward one another... as might be expected from Corps members from such drastically different (borderline contradictory) points of view. This is one I'll likely continue following.

The main Green Lantern title has been kind of good so far, although I have no idea where Johns is going with Sinestro once again being a Green Lantern and having control over Hal Jordan's GL ring. I'll probably continue following this one though.

Green Lantern Corps... honestly, it's good but if you put a gun to my head right now, I'd be hardpressed to tell you what's been going on, apart from a small group of Green Lanterns finding Corps members crucified on some alien planet and getting seriously pissed off about it. I doubt I'll continue following this one.

-- Batman
Detective Comics has been pretty friggin gruesome, actually. This Joker storyline... I mean, yeah, it definitely makes you want to read the next chapter to figure out wtf is going on but... I dunno. The implied gore and violence going on here... I mean, the end of the first issue? Yuck! I can't fault the writing or the art but the content... man! Not sure if I'll keep following this beyond this initial Joker storyline though.

Batman has been fun. Seriously digging Greg Capullo's take on Batman. I've wanted to see him draw Batman ever since I followed him on Spawn when I was a kid so in many ways this is kind of a dream come true. Capullo has serious chops as a comic book storyteller so you already know that he's got the right stuff before you even open the first issue. He did about as good a job as I would've expected too. The guy just has skills, that's all you can really say about it. As to the story at hand, this is probably the only one I don't want to get too spoilery about but I really enjoy it. It plays up the Wayne family's history in Gotham. It's easy to forget that the Waynes have roots in Gotham that go back a pretty long way. But aspects of the second issue really play that point up. Not sure if I'll keep following this title but, on balance, I'd say this one has a very good chance.

I'd put something in here about The Dark Knight but, upon reviewing my longbox, it seems I forgot to pick up issue #2. So hmm. So obviously I have no clue if I'll keep following this series.

Batgirl has been okay. Babs is Batgirl once again. And the Oracle stuff is in continuity still. She was Oracle at one point, she was paralyzed but she is now once again Batgirl. Gail Simone has set up a subplot where it's not immediately explained how she regained her ability to walk but obviously that's the pink elephant in the room. But, good as this book is, I just don't see me following this. Out of budgetary concerns if nothing else, I'll probably drop this title.

-- Everything Else
Firestorm has been intriguing, esp as I know basically nothing about the character. Ronnie and Jason are both essentially complete strangers to me but they're obviously polar opposites from one another so there's lot of room for conflict there. And issue #2 raised the possibility that Firestorm is actually comprised of three people instead of the usual two. Will I keep collecting? It really is 50/50.

The first issue of Aquaman was a lot of fun but, as with TDK, I forgot to pick up the second issue so there's not much I can put in here. But if the second issue is up to snuff, yeah, I'll probably keep following the title.

As far as Swamp Thing is concerned, I picked up the first issue... and have little or no intention of picking up the second. So what's that tell you?

The Flash has been good, with or without my Wally-baggage. I was leaning toward dropping the title after #1 but the second issue puts Barry through a sort of neat evolution of his powers that I want to see play out. The main plot... well, I'd be lying if I told you that it's captivated my attention in a way that no comic book ever has but it seems like a decent enough yarn thus far so I'll likely continue collecting the title at least as far as the end of the first arc. After that... well, we'll just have to see, now won't we?

Justice League (sigh Was there something wrong with including the of America part?) has been good. The plot so far ties in with goings on in George Perez's Superman. Look, I've enjoyed the title and everything, but it's Jim Lee on pencils. The fucker has a demonstrable recent history of being completely unable to meet deadlines so I have to wonder how long it'll be before extensive delays set in. Rumor has it that the New 52 didn't have much of a preparatory lead in period so odds are good the guy's only pencilling issue #4 or #5 right now. For a guy with his track record, that just doesn't confidence that he'll be able to hit his deadlines. That's a problem because I'm obviously enjoying the series. I'll likely keep following it... even though I've got philosophical problems with Vic being on this team rather than the Titans. Call it insensitive if you want but I can't help wondering that he'll be on the team because (A) they needs a black dude and (B) John Stewart's off the table because Hal is already on the team. I don't mind ethnic diversification; it's pointless, unnecessary and transparent ethnic diversification like this that pisses me off. Even so, one thing I've liked about this book is that it doesn't seem to denigrate one character to build another one up. Case in point, part of me was expecting #2 to include a sequence where Batman beats the tar out of Superman... because, y'know, you can't tell a "first meeting between Batman and Superman" story anyfuckingmore without Batman kicking the snot out of Superman at some point. But that ain't how it worked out. Basically GL and Batman get their asses kicked around for a while until Hal calls Barry in who gets everyone involved to chill out already. Nobody got pissed on by anybody else. Superman isn't made to look like a chump so that someone else can look teh aWesome. I appreciated that. However, I do see a bit of a potential continuity problem here. In JL #2, the "team" reconnoiters in what seems to be an abandoned Daily Planet printing press as Superman outright says he doesn't have a base of operations. However, parts of Superman #2 (the events of which presumably occur just after JL #2) make it clear that Superman has the Fortress. But maybe Superman didn't want to share that much with the team.

And now that I think about it, there's another thing going on there too. Green Lantern shows us that Hal is on the outs with the Guardians. He's not even an official GL. But, um, he sure is one in Justice League. Aren't Justice League and GL both taking place "today" (in a comic book sense)? So, um, which is it? Webhead, do you know anything about this?

But yeah, I'll probably keep buying Justice League.

Not sure if Legion of Super-Heroes- Secret Origin counts as part of the New 52 but whatever. Frankly, it's everything that's wrong with Paul Levitz's writing of late, if you ask me. The story is told from the point of view of some cabal watching things unfold with the United Planets, Brande and the nascent Legion. The story takes place entirely apart from the point of view of the protagonists so, as far as origin stories go, we know dick about them in spite of just having read an entire issue ostensibly about this. Say whatever you want about previous Secret Origin series, they at least went to pains to introduce the main characters on their own terms rather than being filtered through a hostile party's perceptions. Someone completely unfamiliar with the Legion wouldn't know jackshit about them after reading this book. It plays well if you're already familiar with the team... but, as this is called Secret Origin, the entire fucking conceit is that the reader ISN'T familiar with them, THAT'S THE ENTIRE MOTHERFUCKING POINT!! All this does is show me that I made the right decision in dropping the Legion titles. With an attitude like this, do you really think I'll buy the second issue?

Anywho. Overall, the New 52 has been a mixed bag in terms of the titles I've bought but considering how few DC titles I was collecting prior to Flashpoint, I'd have to say that it's successfully gotten me back in the saddle for at least seven books. In fact, I'd probably follow the entire line (except maybe four or five titles) if I could afford it so you can't argue this hasn't been effective at least for my participation.
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Re: General DC Relaunch Thread (including FAQ)

Post  thecolorsblend on Mon Nov 07, 2011 3:28 pm

-- October 2011 Sales (as per Diamond)
DC COMICS- 42.47%
MARVEL COMICS- 29.10%

Source URL- http://www.diamondcomics.com/Home/1/1/3/597/114677

Basically, DC kicked Marvel's ass pretty decisively in October. Not bad! Clearly this is driven mostly by The New 52... although I'll come back to this. Is it sustainable? Well, I personally doubt it but this matches up with my October buying. I'd wager that about half my purchases were DC issues.

Here's the rub though. I was experimenting with other titles. I mean, why not? This is the perfect opportunity. Thus far, I've decided to stick with Justice League, Aquaman, both Superman titles, Superboy, Green Lantern and Green Lantern- New Guardians, one Batman title and the Flash.

However, that's the pruned version. I bought a lot more than that in October to come to this decision. Bottom line? It's waaaaaay too soon to spike the football. I suspect many other readers likewise experimented with new (to them) titles before settling on their final lists. This may be worth revisiting in, I dunno, May 2012 but for now, this whole thing seems too new to rate.

Some other notes though. I don't think this is entirely driven by The New 52 titles though. Marvel's big crossover was Fear Itself. Fear Itself was good, I guess, but surprisingly DC's Flashpoint ended up being the more entertaining read (trust me, nobody was more surprised by that than I was).
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Re: General DC Relaunch Thread (including FAQ)

Post  webhead2006 on Mon Nov 07, 2011 6:37 pm

ya lets see where sales are in 3-6 more months compared to now.
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Re: General DC Relaunch Thread (including FAQ)

Post  Apologist Puncher on Mon Nov 07, 2011 8:22 pm

The way I understand it, retailers severely under-ordered on DC's #1's, making them over-order on #2's.

Let's see the numbers after issue 5 or 6.

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Re: General DC Relaunch Thread (including FAQ)

Post  thecolorsblend on Tue Nov 08, 2011 2:29 am

Apologist Puncher wrote:The way I understand it, retailers severely under-ordered on DC's #1's, making them over-order on #2's.
That would tend to explain the flurry of reprints that a lot of the #1's got. Even so, and I acknowledge that this is completely anecdotal, my local shop had #1's out the ears. JL, Action, Batman, Teen Titans, Green Lantern, you name it. Other stores I've visited, it's a pretty similar story. Not questioning that report or anything, just that it confused me based on what I've seen.

Let's see the numbers after issue 5 or 6.
I'm actually thinking we'll see the numbers balance starting with #3 and #4. I've basically finalized my list. Good as, say, Batgirl is, it's just not worth my money when there's other stuff I want to buy. I like Babs, cool character, Simone is a great writer, blah blah blah, I'm just not going to buy the book. As I say, I've pretty much finalized my list and I refuse to think I'm unique in that regard. When the final numbers come in for #4, I think we'll see the market adjusting to The New 52. After that, DC will have to earn their place in the market after the passing interest has faded.

What I will say though is that this looks like it's been largely good for the biz. There's been a lot of interest and attention and several of the books I've read really do cut it as entertaining titles. If I had more disposable income, I can pretty much guarantee you that I'd be following a shitload more titles. The DCU would pretty much be my playground at this point. But at these cover prices... well, who the hell can afford THAT?
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Re: General DC Relaunch Thread (including FAQ)

Post  webhead2006 on Mon Nov 14, 2011 12:51 pm

Here is first look at Darkseid in his DCnU/ New 52 first appearance in Justice League #4:
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Re: General DC Relaunch Thread (including FAQ)

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